Bassists and Shades Of Rock

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Re: Bassists and Shades Of Rock

Postby Arpeggio » Sat Apr 14, 2018 5:22 pm

It's nearly 30 years since I first asked Hank, Bruce and Brian about "Shades Of Rock". Of course, at the time they, themselves, were thinking back nearly 20 years. Maybe most of the tracks were laid down within a three week period. This is what I have been able to discover. Maybe Tony Hoffman / Dave Herbert can add more?

March 11th, 1970 " Satisfaction" / "Lucille" / "Bony Maronie"

March 22nd, 1970 "My Babe" / " River Deep, Mountain High"

May 9th, 1970 "Paperback Writer" / "Get Back"

Plus, the unissued "Hi Heeled Sneakers"(maybe they did not want a 13 track LP??) and there are complete (obviously ) unissued AVs of several tracks.
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Re: Bassists and Shades Of Rock

Postby iefje » Mon Apr 16, 2018 9:58 am

Arpeggio wrote:It's nearly 30 years since I first asked Hank, Bruce and Brian about "Shades Of Rock". Of course, at the time they, themselves, were thinking back nearly 20 years. Maybe most of the tracks were laid down within a three week period. This is what I have been able to discover. Maybe Tony Hoffman / Dave Herbert can add more?

March 11th, 1970 " Satisfaction" / "Lucille" / "Bony Maronie"

March 22nd, 1970 "My Babe" / " River Deep, Mountain High"

May 9th, 1970 "Paperback Writer" / "Get Back"

Plus, the unissued "Hi Heeled Sneakers"(maybe they did not want a 13 track LP??) and there are complete (obviously ) unissued AVs of several tracks.


Thank you very much, another part of the puzzle solved! It is known that Dave Richmond played fuzz bass on "Get Back", so he must also have played on "Paperback Writer".
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Re: Bassists and Shades Of Rock

Postby Arpeggio » Mon Apr 16, 2018 10:11 am

Oh we love it...don't we. 48 years since the Shads recorded Shades of Rock!! Here we are, still trying to pin down who played bass on the respective tracks.. As previously stated, if Mo Foster / Alan Jones /Laurence Canty are right about John playing bass on "Satisfaction" and "Lucille", then he must have also played on "Bony Maronie"(as the three tracks were recorded on the same day). It would also make sense that the Shads would have used John if he was available. Clearly he was free in early March. Presumably, those were the first three tracks laid down for the project. Again, maybe Stuart Duffy might know why John was unavailable after early March, 1970??
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Re: Bassists and Shades Of Rock

Postby StuartD » Mon Apr 16, 2018 11:28 am

Hi

John was not available from March because he was with Tom Jones.

After the Show on New Years Eve 1969, the Shadows, with Alan Hawkshaw, did the Cliff Richard Show - Wonderful Land- Rock n' Roll Medley - Move it with John on Fender Bass.
They were next scheduled for two week's Cabaret in Late March- Early April. The week at Batley Variety Club started 29th March. I went to the sound check on the Sunday afternoon and David Bryce said: "John's not with us you know". I asked who the bass player was and it was Paul Ferris. Brian told me that John was working with Tom Jones and that he knew what the money was like with Tom and he could't really turn it down for 'two weeks with Hank'. The week following the Shads at Batley it was Cliff. He started on Sunday 5th April, Brian and Alan backed him with the Batley band. Cliff finished on the 11th and on the 12th The Shads did their second week at Wythenshawe Golden Garter.

Once they had finished, on 18th, they had one more gig with Paul- the NME Poll Winners concert on May 3rd. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/New-Musical- ... 1674189192


They then finished as the Shadows at Sheffield Fiesta Club - the opening week- in August 1970 and John was on Bass. He used the Fender again because, in his words, 'The Burns is knackered!!' John had his beard on these his final appearances with the Shadows... Later MWF were formed. During the week at Sheffield, the Shadows played 'Something' and it was totally different bass playing from John to the one on the record.

I first heard the album at Brian's house in Lullington Garth. It was on 7" singles. I know Herbie Flowers is on Memphis and Something and Dave Richmond is definitely on Get Back because Brian told me he used "John's Fuzz Box - do you remember John's Fuzz Box" - Bombay Duck!. A lot of conjecture has always surrounded the bass players and one theory put forward- by Mo Foster, who has much more knowledge than me- is that some tracks sound like the Burns and they could be John. Well Dave Richmond exclusively used a Burns Bison Bass at that time and using the fact that John didn't use the Burns from New Years Eve 1969 until August 1970, it seems highly unlikely that he would have recorded with it. John also told me he had the Jazz Bass sprayed white to match the Burns white/tortoiseshell set up.

Hope this helps

Stuart
Last edited by StuartD on Tue Apr 17, 2018 10:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Bassists and Shades Of Rock

Postby Arpeggio » Mon Apr 16, 2018 11:46 am

Many thanks Stuart. Such first hand recollections from someone like yourself are invaluable. Well, maybe John just happened to have that one free day. I genuinely posit the fact that John was on "Shades Of Rock" purely because Brian Bennett has always maintained that John played on at least 2 tracks and Hank and Bruce are also adamant that John played bass "on at least two tracks...possibly three." Yes...there is slight uncertainty....but they were all 3 (& independently of each other) adamant that John did play on "Shades Of Rock"...but, yes, that they also employed Dave Richmond, Herbie Flowers and Brian Odgers. Thanks once again, Stuart for your priceless info re John's final stint playing in England.
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Re: Bassists and Shades Of Rock

Postby drakula63 » Mon Apr 16, 2018 12:49 pm

Thanks for drawing our attention to the 1970 NME Poll Winners programme on ebay. A bit too expensive for me, but very interesting to see the line-up and, in particular, the line-up for HANK MARVIN & THE SHADOWS!

HANK MARVIN, PAUL FERRIS, ALAN HAWKSHAW, BRIAN BENNETT.

I have taken the liberty of copying the centre pages of the programme which show these.
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Re: Bassists and Shades Of Rock

Postby Arpeggio » Mon Apr 16, 2018 4:29 pm

I'm not a huge Tom Jones expert / devotee. Obviously Tom Jones was based out in L A during the late 1960s / early 1970s. He was amongst the first 'superstars' to have long residencies at the Hotels / Casinos in in Las Vegas - following the earlier trend set by the Rat Pack era. He also went on tour during breaks in his 'residency' schedules. I discovered that he left the Las Vegas Hilton at the end of 1969 and signed a 3 year deal with Caesar's Palace in 1970. He was due to open there on April 20th, 1970. Stuart Duffy noted that John was definitely out in the USA by the end of March, 1970. Undoubtedly Tom Jones would have been rehearsing ready for his April 20th debut (which specified a straight month initially). But, John could have easily been back in the UK for a few days around March 11th. (At that point the C P opening night would be virtually 6 weeks away).The timing does fit. Viz....Tom Jones was clearly between residencies and may have taken a month or two out. As I say, I am not a T J expert, but I believe those dates / facts to be fairly accurate.
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Re: Bassists and Shades Of Rock

Postby JimN » Mon Apr 16, 2018 6:14 pm

drakula63 wrote:Thanks for drawing our attention to the 1970 NME Poll Winners programme on ebay. A bit too expensive for me, but very interesting to see the line-up and, in particular, the line-up for HANK MARVIN & THE SHADOWS!

HANK MARVIN, PAUL FERRIS, ALAN HAWKSHAW, BRIAN BENNETT.

I have taken the liberty of copying the centre pages of the programme which show these.


Fascinating stuff and (having enlarged the image), several line-ups are of interest there.

Songwriting team (sometimes Lordan collaborators) Roger Greenaway and Roger Cook (formerly known as David and Jonathan with Lovers Of The World Unite) were both there - with different acts. Cook with Blue Mink and Greenaway with Brotherhood Of Man. Roger Greenaway and Brotherhood Man band-mate Tony Burrows also appeared as a separate act: Pipkins (Gimme Dat Ding?).

I had no idea that White Plains (always supposed to be a pure session band) had done any live performances. As far as I recall, they only had one semi-hit (When You Are A King).

I see also that Steve Ellis was billed separately from Love Affair (and not even adjacent on the programme).

And only two American acts as far as I can see (not sure about Bob and Marcia).

Didn't the steel guitarist from Juicy Lucy usually refer to himself as Glen Fernando Campbell in order to prevent confusion with the singer of Wichita Lineman?
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Re: Bassists and Shades Of Rock

Postby JimN » Mon Apr 16, 2018 6:16 pm

StuartD wrote:Hi

John was not available from March because he was with Tom Jones.

After the Show on New Years Eve 1969, the Shadows, with Alan Hawkshaw, did the Cliff Richard Show - Wonderful Land- Rock n' Roll Medley - Move it with John on Fender Bass.
They were next scheduled for two week's Cabaret in Late March- Early April. The week at Batley Variety Club started 29th March. I went to the sound check on the Sunday after noon and David Bryce said: "John's not with us you know". I asked who the bass player was and it was Paul Ferris. Brian told me that John was working with Tom Jones and that he know what the money was like with Tom and he could't really turn it down for 'two weeks with Hank'. The week following the Shads at Batley it was Cliff. He started on Sunday 5th April, Brian and Alan backed him with the Batley band. Cliff finished on the 11th and on the 12th The Shads did their second week at Wythenshawe Golden Garter.

Once they had finished, on 18th, they had one more gig with Paul- the NME Poll Winners concert on May 3rd. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/New-Musical- ... 1674189192


They then finished as the Shadows at Sheffield Fiesta Club - the opening week- in August 1970 and John was on Bass. He used the Fender again because, in his words, 'The Burns is knackered!!' John had his beard on these his final appearances with the Shadows... Later MWF were formed. During the week at Sheffield, the Shadows played 'Something' and it was totally different bass playing from John to the one on the record.

I first heard the album at Brian's house in Lullington Garth. It was on 7" singles. I know Herbie Flowers is on Memphis and Something and Dave Richmond is definitely on Get Back because Brian told me he used "John's Fuzz Box - do you remember John's Fuzz Box" - Bombay Duck!. A lot of conjecture has always surrounded the bass players and one theory put forward- by Mo Foster, who has much more knowledge than me- is that some tracks sound like the Burns and they could be John. Well Dave Richmond exclusively used a Burns Bison Bass at that time and using the fact that John didn't use the Burns from New Years Eve 1969 until August 1970, it seems highly unlikely that he would have recorded with it. John also told me he had the Jazz Bass sprayed white to match the Burns white/tortoiseshell set up.

Hope this helps

Stuart


Thanks, Stuart.

I now realise that some of the information I already had must have come from you. All of your certainties were reflected in my list!
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Re: Bassists and Shades Of Rock

Postby alewis41 » Mon Apr 16, 2018 10:51 pm

StuartD wrote:
I first heard the album at Brian's house in Lullington Garth. It was on 7" singles. I know Herbie Flowers is on Memphis and Something and Dave Richmond is definitely on Get Back because Brian told me he used "John's Fuzz Box - do you remember John's Fuzz Box" - Bombay Duck!. A lot of conjecture has always surrounded the bass players and one theory put forward- by Mo Foster, who has much more knowledge than me- is that some tracks sound like the Burns and they could be John. Well Dave Richmond exclusively used a Burns Bison Bass at that time and using the fact that John didn't use the Burns from New Years Eve 1969 until August 1970, it seems highly unlikely that he would have recorded with it. John also told me he had the Jazz Bass sprayed white to match the Burns white/tortoiseshell set up.

Hope this helps

Stuart


Hi Stuart, can you say any more about the 7" singles? Never heard about a demo version of the album on singles before.

Cheers,

Andrew
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