New Echo Unit

[noelford]

As I said, Dave, that demo is not the unit we are talking about. I (and a lot more players) believe that Charlie really has cracked it with the current model.

[dave robinson]

Sorry, but that's really not helpful or relevant now. That sample is the early one which is not at all representative of the unit at its current stage of development. As I understand it, a new set of sample sound-files is on the way soon. If taking stock is in order, bear in mind the large number of players at Northwich who could not tell the difference between the current model and the Meazzi.

Noel, the comparison with the Meazzi that you speak of is invalid, as Hank's machine was a completely different beast to the Meazzi tape echo. I wouldn't want a machine that sounds like a Meazzi tape echo - it's not what it was.
I hope Charlie realises this and get's the sound of the records instead, knowing him I'm certain that he will and I look forward to the final product.
I have played through and heard several Meazzi tape echo machines and still firmly believe the guitar and amp are more influential in obtaining the right sound.
I know some of you will all shout the name Justin Daish as an example because he had his Meazzi and the sound at last years SM, but remember the amp he was playing it through? No echo machine will give you the sound on it's own.

[dave robinson]

As I said, Dave, that demo is not the unit we are talking about. I (and a lot more players) believe that Charlie really has cracked it with the current model.

So why is everyone jumping through hoops about the demo then?

[noelford]

I've no idea!

Actually, Dave, I'm not one of those for whom 'That Sound' is the Holy Grail, and I'm very happy with my own kit and tone. And I fully accept, and agree with you, about the ingredients that go to into making any tone. However, going on what I heard at Northwich, I can vouch for the authentic sounds which Charlie's prototype unit was producing. I should add that I have no vested interest in this unit!

[Abbeyroadie]

Phil,
First and foremost my original posting was intended to highlight the debt we owe Charlie (and now John Collins)for his work and fortunately there are many others that agree with me, that done successfully I don't feel that I have to comment any further on that aspect.

My input to this topic would now appear to have been derailed somewhat and has gone in different directions.
There are many members to this site and they will come to their own conclusions and hopefully maybe even post some of them.

In response to your last message suffice to say that you know what goes on at your Staffs club I don't and on that point I can't argue ....

However I do have 20 years experience in the music business both as a High Street Music Shop & mail order retailer and manufacturer, it seems to me you have no idea of how much time and money goes into bringing a new product to the market by a small manufacturer making limited numbers of specialsed equipment and you probably don't care either why should you ?

However I feel you being less than realistic with your price threshold ideas and it would appear that I'm not alone in thinking that either.

In this particular instance not being part of the new project I neither have contol or influence in the final price any way whatsoever.

PeterA

[keithmantle]

Hi Peter, When you consider the price of a TVS 3 Charlies new unit should be an absolute steal !

[Abbeyroadie]

Hi Keith,
Ain't that the truth..........

[PeterV]

Sorry, but that's really not helpful or relevant now. That sample is the early one which is not at all representative of the unit at its current stage of development. As I understand it, a new set of sample sound-files is on the way soon. If taking stock is in order, bear in mind the large number of players at Northwich who could not tell the difference between the current model and the Meazzi.

Noel, the comparison with the Meazzi that you speak of is invalid, as Hank's machine was a completely different beast to the Meazzi tape echo. I wouldn't want a machine that sounds like a Meazzi tape echo - it's not what it was.
I hope Charlie realises this and get's the sound of the records instead, knowing him I'm certain that he will and I look forward to the final product.
I have played through and heard several Meazzi tape echo machines and still firmly believe the guitar and amp are more influential in obtaining the right sound.
I know some of you will all shout the name Justin Daish as an example because he had his Meazzi and the sound at last years SM, but remember the amp he was playing it through? No echo machine will give you the sound on it's own.

In most cases the process to obtain the timings are done as demonstrated here: http://www.echotapper.nl/wp/?p=221
In many cases they are in alignment with the known vintage echo's, in addition, sometimes reverb is added and sometimes, although  very rare, additional processing like sound dubbing is added as an extra process.
 
  -Piet

[tonybiker]

Hi.

An interesting debate, but I do feel a few have missed some important points that are very relevant.

Firstly, why was at the weekend event in first place?. This was my idea, and as the organiser of the event I wanted the unit there, and it was not until approx 10 days before that I knew a unit of some sort would be there. For those who attended, I made sure they were all aware that the unit was a 'PROTOTYPE'. I was grateful to Charlie for working overtime to make this possible. It was never said what was at Northwich is what would be available at some point in the future.

The sound file. This is not relevant because it was not done on the prototype unit. If you read the post it's clear as day, it was a tester and it was not even done on the prefered guitar either. The intention was, which I do give credit to Charlie for, was to get members of his site involved in the develpment. A simple fact remains, which do you trust, a sound file uploaded to the internet? or seeing, hearing and playing it in a real enviroment? Thats why out of the 51 people at the event not a single one had passed a negative comment.

No one is saying or said that the 'prototype' is what will be sold when Charlie Hall and John Collins are happy with the final unit. You may not even see it this year, who knows, and it will not even look the same. Those that were at the event simply heard a unit under development, which just happened to tick all the box's as far as sound was concerned. I am sure that it will even sound different today than it did 2 weeks ago, it's working progress.

Those of you that were about in the days of UB Hank Club will remember how much the Club was involved with the original EFTP, the Club was present with Charlie Hall when Hank Marvin first tried out a Quad with EFTP. And I once again see a guy who is happy to share what he knows and appreciates members thoughts and inputs whilst developing his new unit, which will only benefit everyone in the long run. Better to get it right first time would you say?

The problem here, and I don't know why it is, but it seems acceptable to move the goal posts once someone feels they are loosing the debate. One week it is fine to compare a TVS3 with a Meazzi, so it's only natural that guys like Noel Ford, a guy who does know his stuff and was stationed right next to Charlie's Tech Area when the unit was being used, uses it to compare Charlie's new unit, and likewise, that why I used it to compare. Justin Daish never brought his amp, just his Meazzi. The unit was plugged into all manners of amps as well, and there were a few!

Uploaded sound files are open to be sexed up, live sound is not, and the fact remains, which there is no getting away from, 51 people including myself heard the unit plugged into different amps and used with all manners of guitars for between 8 and 16 hours, and came away knowing we had heard the best sounding echo to date, which in itself is some feat considering every other EFTP unit was also present and working that weekend.

Hope that further clarifies some of the points raised.

Tony

[Amanda]

I know that Charlie has done a great deal more work on the echos, basing the new unit on
the original sounds from the records, and has added refinements to the patches.

It's not based on tape Meazzi sounds.

Amanda