How essential is the Vibrato (Trem) ?

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Re: How essential is the Vibrato (Trem) ?

Postby Iain Purdon » Tue Sep 19, 2017 9:11 am

It's what it is. The more guitarists develop their own style, the more authentic they will become as players and the less they will need to worry about what a talented teenager was doing back in the late 1950s. :D
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Re: How essential is the Vibrato (Trem) ?

Postby Tigerdaisy » Tue Sep 19, 2017 9:50 am

I never said the trem wasn't needed and I agree its a big part of 'the sound', I just prefer the early use of it compared to the current 'clinical' technique.
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Re: How essential is the Vibrato (Trem) ?

Postby dave robinson » Tue Sep 19, 2017 1:13 pm

Tigerdaisy wrote:I never said the trem wasn't needed and I agree its a big part of 'the sound', I just prefer the early use of it compared to the current 'clinical' technique.



Who's or what current clinical technique exactly ?
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Re: How essential is the Vibrato (Trem) ?

Postby RogerCook » Tue Sep 19, 2017 2:48 pm

Hank's tremolo technique is not the same now as it was in the early years, and why should it be? His playing has evolved and whilst maybe not to everyone's taste, it is the sound he wants to make nowadays. As far as I'm concerned he more or less invented the tremolo style so that makes him a legend in my book. On a personal note though, I have to admit to preferring the earlier work.
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Re: How essential is the Vibrato (Trem) ?

Postby Hank2k » Tue Sep 19, 2017 3:17 pm

There is a really interesting sound clip on youtube from the TVS guys highlighting hanks change over the years. I guess the big factor is like us all when we were 19 and just starting playing guitar etc you tend to play a lot different. The more experienced you get your technique develops and changes how you hit the strings etc
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Re: How essential is the Vibrato (Trem) ?

Postby Allclaphands » Tue Sep 19, 2017 4:38 pm

Considering that Hank originally had a Antoria LG50 with no Tremolo before getting the Fender Strat
he had to learn how to set it up and how and when to use it when playing which I might add he did
a great job of being self taught as proven in his early recordings ect. but as already mentioned his
technique altered and became more refined over the years
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Re: How essential is the Vibrato (Trem) ?

Postby cockroach » Wed Sep 20, 2017 4:02 am

IIRC, Hank said that he was not impressed with the guitar playing on early British rock records as the players had no feeling for the material and just played a series of notes etc, whereas the American players like James Burton, and Cliff Gallup bent notes etc...he said he tried this, but couldn't get the same effect as the guitar strings were too heavy...he said he used the vibrato arm to seek to get the same effect- but that although it sounded OK it wasn't exactly what he intended...as he humourously said- his style was a mixture of the styles he was copying and trying to achieve...but FAILED to do! :D

He also said that using the vibrato gave more of a singing vocal quality to the notes...and that whereas early on he played and grabbed the vibrato arm when he wanted to bend a note or chord, later on, he just played with the vibrato arm in his hand all the time..

So his use of the vibrato sort of developed as he developed as a player I suppose..

Seems to me that if you like Hank and want to play in his style, either early Shads or later stuff, the vibrato arm is essential..

(Personally, I have never used a vibrato, but I started a bit later in my first group playing Stones stuff etc which usually didn't involve use of a vibrato...and a bit later started using light strings for bending notes...which apparently Hank didn't do until some years later..when I play Shads stuff these days, I do so without a vibrato)
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Re: How essential is the Vibrato (Trem) ?

Postby Tigerdaisy » Wed Sep 20, 2017 9:34 am

dave robinson wrote:
Tigerdaisy wrote:I never said the trem wasn't needed and I agree its a big part of 'the sound', I just prefer the early use of it compared to the current 'clinical' technique.



Who's or what current clinical technique ecactly ?


The effect of the trem is lost by overuse, in a similar way on the Hammond where some player have the Leslie on the go all the time- it loses the dramatic effect you get when its just used as a climatic effect. HBM early use of the trem was more selective and aggressive and had attitude whereas now it sounds more like songs on sunday with leather bound bibles and Devon Violets aftershave. That's how it seems to me- just my opinion. In the early days I'd have loved a Strat with a trem, but these days I don't even own a Strat.
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Re: How essential is the Vibrato (Trem) ?

Postby dave robinson » Wed Sep 20, 2017 12:14 pm

Tigerdaisy wrote:
dave robinson wrote:
Tigerdaisy wrote:I never said the trem wasn't needed and I agree its a big part of 'the sound', I just prefer the early use of it compared to the current 'clinical' technique.



Who's or what current clinical technique ecactly ?


The effect of the trem is lost by overuse, in a similar way on the Hammond where some player have the Leslie on the go all the time- it loses the dramatic effect you get when its just used as a climatic effect. HBM early use of the trem was more selective and aggressive and had attitude whereas now it sounds more like songs on sunday with leather bound bibles and Devon Violets aftershave. That's how it seems to me- just my opinion. In the early days I'd have loved a Strat with a trem, but these days I don't even own a Strat.


Your opinion is valid to a point, as some players do over emphasise the Vibrato arm, mainly wannabees. Hank certainly does not. People who I enjoy listening to such as Chet Atkins, Jeff Beck, Duane Eddy and David Gilmour to name a few, actually use the vibrato arm in a very effective way and without it their music would lack the 'feel' that they gain from it.
I have mentioned 'feel' on this site more times than I care to mention, but it is something that few possess.

The other important factor regarding Hank's use of the vibrato back then compared to today, is the heavy string guages that were only available at that time, on which the vibrato had very little effect compared to the light guages of today, where just a slight touch will detune the strings a great deal. It is this that makes the use of todays players sound excessive, unless of course the are gifted with 'feel', which most players know only allows the slightest touch on the vibrato bar before sounding over done.

As for the use of the Leslie speaker, yes, I too have heard that abused over the years, mainly by organists with no 'feel" as described above. I rid myself of the problem by not listening to them, it's that easy. :)
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Re: How essential is the Vibrato (Trem) ?

Postby Vincent » Thu Sep 21, 2017 5:49 pm

dave robinson wrote:
Vincent wrote:
nivramarvin wrote:Also on double stops finger vibrato is not possible - for me anyway.


It's very good for sounding like a cat! -like the one in the photo...and not forgetting Jimi Hendrix :thumbup:


I look forward to hearing some of your sound files if you would care to post some, so that we all may admire your expertise in this field. :)


No sound files & I'm not an expert...
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