soundfiles using original shadows backings

[phil kelly]

bravo for posting Hanks original guitar sound of the Savage mixed with the ubhank backing track, serves to prove the point i was trying to make in that if the core sound of the echo unit is right on the money then it will still sound good when mixed with any reasonable backing track, you dont have to use the original shads backings to prove this, yes using the original will bring it closer obviously as a total mix etc but it surely can only prove positive for an echo unit if you hear it not in this comfort zone and it still delivers the goods, and if this was the case i know i would throw some money at it, i still reiterate in no way am i talking in a negative way about the brilliant tvs 3 or indeed Charlies machine for that matter, both great sounding bits of kit, and yes quite close to the original, although as a player my preference to use the old original machines has not changed, just my opinion of course, i know what i hear but of course everybody hears different.
Phil.

[Patrice]

Hi Dave
You says:

So, to put it in a nutshell, the Meazzi drum based machine (SEP) adds a character to the tone of a Fender Stratocaster and Vox AC-15 or AC-30 amplifier that the tape based Meazzi doesn't, even though the circuits are very similar..
How fortunate we are that Charlie Hall and John Collins have captured this and made the Hall & Collins Signature echo with all of these attributes - job done.

Yes they did a great job !
But:
That I want to say, it's that there a difference between the halo of echo generated by a tape Meazzi and a drum SEP.
Like Phil I can speak about this, because I used (with the time...) the booth : an Echomatic Meazzi (modified for getting the right delays) and for the second one a clone of the SEP/Vox Echo with my modified Binson (for the drum)
Binson that I imagine that it generates a final result "near" or as near as possible than the SEP/Vox Echo?!!!
So it's also the reason why I can say that in the first case (with the tape) you can always hear the succession of the x delays on the "open" notes.
With the drum system, these x delays are (more) mixed together for doing a "large" halo of echo like a large reverb.

For exemple, there a recording of Wonderful Land live (multi tracks) during a rehearsal session of our band.
You can hear my lead guitar "alone" (with just a little bit bass and drums !) and the whole things (harmonic distorsion, wow and flutter, and this particular halo of reverb) done by this SEP clone...
And beleive me : No reverb added on this track just the "halo" of my Binson/SEP. (Hope now that the attachment will work...)

<iframe src="https://app.box.com/embed/preview/a9bh3hkbxqktu7p6vrbw2il3z956sbsq?theme=dark" width="500" height="88" frameborder="0"allowfullscreen webkitallowfullscreen msallowfullscreen></iframe>

If surely , it's not That Sound of the record, I think (I hope ?) that the "philosophy" of the "sound of the Shadows" and mainly this "quality" of reverb are here ?

Kind regards from France
Patrice

[Gary Allen]

Hi Patrice, Fantastic Sound...heres your link https://app.box.com/embed/preview/a9bh3hkbxqktu7p6vrbw2il3z956sbsq?

[JohanDeGreyze]

I agree, very nice sound indeed, but for now I will stick to The Savage:

Three different examples, but NOT with Hank's lead:
1. Savage 1
2. Savage 2
3. Savage 3

All three recorded with the same settings and equipment.

Now, my statement is that if you want to make a copy (agreed not everybody wants that) then all conditions should meet with the source. Some of them are more important and some less. One very important item is, play it like Hank and with his touch. If we do not do that then the comment is ah well nicely played but it not as the original. Another very important item which already has been stated by others here is the echo and the amount of reverbs used. Play Wonderful land with the settings of Atlantis and you are out of business And there are more items mentioned here as well like string gauge, plectrum, guitar model/pickups, etc.
........ And now you want me to believe that it is totally unimportant in what backing it is played? Well that may be the problem, it is a belief. Some of you do not believe it I belief it absolutely...no offence of course These kind of things makes us have lively discussions.

Cheers
Jan

[dave robinson]

Hi Dave
You says:

So, to put it in a nutshell, the Meazzi drum based machine (SEP) adds a character to the tone of a Fender Stratocaster and Vox AC-15 or AC-30 amplifier that the tape based Meazzi doesn't, even though the circuits are very similar..
How fortunate we are that Charlie Hall and John Collins have captured this and made the Hall & Collins Signature echo with all of these attributes - job done.

Yes they did a great job !
But:
That I want to say, it's that there a difference between the halo of echo generated by a tape Meazzi and a drum SEP.
Like Phil I can speak about this, because I used (with the time...) the booth : an Echomatic Meazzi (modified for getting the right delays) and for the second one a clone of the SEP/Vox Echo with my modified Binson (for the drum)
Binson that I imagine that it generates a final result "near" or as near as possible than the SEP/Vox Echo?!!!
So it's also the reason why I can say that in the first case (with the tape) you can always hear the succession of the x delays on the "open" notes.
With the drum system, these x delays are (more) mixed together for doing a "large" halo of echo like a large reverb.

For exemple, there a recording of Wonderful Land live (multi tracks) during a rehearsal session of our band.
You can hear my lead guitar "alone" (with just a little bit bass and drums !) and the whole things (harmonic distorsion, wow and flutter, and this particular halo of reverb) done by this SEP clone...
And beleive me : No reverb added on this track just the "halo" of my Binson/SEP. (Hope now that the attachment will work...)

<iframe src="https://app.box.com/embed/preview/a9bh3hkbxqktu7p6vrbw2il3z956sbsq?theme=dark" width="500" height="88" frameborder="0"allowfullscreen webkitallowfullscreen msallowfullscreen></iframe>

If surely , it's not That Sound of the record, I think (I hope ?) that the "philosophy" of the "sound of the Shadows" and mainly this "quality" of reverb are here ?

Kind regards from France
Patrice

It is indeed a lovely sound although probably coloured by the Binson drum a little, I believe that the SEP drum was different materials and would have had different sonic properties ?
However, it's still a great sounding machine, congratulations on building it successfully.