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Checking through my LP collection for one of those Facebook challenges to post the covers of constantly-played albums (which I am strictly interpreting as meaning vinyl discs and not cassettes or CDs), I came across the entry discussed below

LPs are easily isolated within my database and I have 306 of them, it seems. And each entry in my database has a space for textual information, which often includes the place where I bought the item, the price paid (if remembered) and any other odd info such as whether the contents are duplicated on CD / CD-R, etc. Some, though, have other snippets of information, and this one is a good example:

TITLE: SHADES OF ROCK LP
ARTIST(S): SHADOWS, The
YEAR: 1970
LABEL: EMI/Columbia (UK)
NUMBER: SCX 6420 (stereo)

CONTENTS:
1. Proud Mary
2. My Babe
3. Lucille
4. Johnny B. Goode (instrumental version)
5. Paperback Writer
6. (I Can't Get No) Satisfaction

1. Bony Moronie
2. Get Back
3. Something
4. River Deep, Mountain High
5. Memphis
6. What'd I Say?

TEXT:
A puzzling 1970 LP, released when the group did not officially exist. Bruce Welch does not appear. All tracks repeated on CD.

Bassists (as far as is known):

1. Proud Mary [Herbie Flowers]
2. My Babe [Dave Richmond or Herbie Flowers or Brian Hodges]
3. Lucille [John Rostill - similar playing to that on BB's "Change Of Direction" album?]
4. Johnny B. Goode [Dave Richmond or Herbie Flowers or Brian Hodges]
5. Paperback Writer [Dave Richmond or Herbie Flowers or Brian Hodges]
6. (I Can't Get No) Satisfaction [John Rostill]

1. Bony Moronie [Dave Richmond or Herbie Flowers or Brian Hodges]
2. Get Back [Dave Richmond]
3. Something [Herbie Flowers]
4. River Deep, Mountain High [Dave Richmond or Herbie Flowers or Brian Hodges]
5. Memphis [Herbie Flowers]
6. What'd I Say? [Dave Richmond or Herbie Flowers or Brian Hodges]

{end of entry]

What puzzles me is where I got that latter information (such as it is). Does anyone have any narrowing data, and/or can any of the above be verified?

I have the same information as you, more or less, Jim. And, like you, am not sure of my source.

It is known that Dave Richmond, Herbie Flowers and A N Other* took part on bass in the sessions. There is no documentation AFAIK that specifies who did which track. There is also doubt about the involvement of John Rostill. There is the odd track that sounds like him but no written record of his presence, also he was working with Tom Jones at around the same time.

*A N Other is variously identified as Brian Hodges in your data and also Malcolm Campbell's, but as Brian "Badger" Odgers in Victor Rust's book. Odgers is also mentioned in the Mo Foster book in his section on session players of the early seventies. Take your pick.

JimN wrote:What puzzles me is where I got that latter information (such as it is). Does anyone have any narrowing data, and/or can any of the above be verified?

You have probably got the information on the bassists via Malcolm Campbell's book "A Pocket Guide To Shadow Music". One of the bassists names is Brian Odgers, not Brian Hodges.

iefje wrote:

JimN wrote:What puzzles me is where I got that latter information (such as it is). Does anyone have any narrowing data, and/or can any of the above be verified?

You have probably got the information on the bassists via Malcolm Campbell's book "A Pocket Guide To Shadow Music". One of the bassists names is Brian Odgers, not Brian Hodges.

In that case, I didn't get it from there!

I wouldn't make a mistake like that and in fact, I would have acknowledged the source (for my own reasons and convenience) within the database entry. No, I must have gleaned that information from a source which had the name as "Hodges".

JimN wrote:I must have gleaned that information from a source which had the name as "Hodges".

Yes, Jim and, as I said in my answer above, Malcolm's data did give me the name as Hodges!

Iain Purdon wrote:It is known that Dave Richmond, Herbie Flowers and A N Other* took part on bass in the sessions. There is no documentation AFAIK that specifies who did which track. There is also doubt about the involvement of John Rostill. There is the odd track that sounds like him but no written record of his presence, also he was working with Tom Jones at around the same time.

*A N Other is variously identified as Brian Hodges in your data and also Malcolm Campbell's, but as Brian "Badger" Odgers in Victor Rust's book. Odgers is also mentioned in the Mo Foster book in his section on session players of the early seventies. Take your pick.

But I should have specified the data I meant: "The Shadows at EMI: The Vinyl Legacy" by Malcolm Campbell.

I don't have the "Pocket Guide" but, having read Ivo's reply, I've just looked it up online and Malcolm has corrected the entry there! This is what it says:

Different bass guitarists were employed, but no precise records have ever been discovered: they included Dave Richmond, Herbie Flowers and Brian Odgers (aka ‘Badger’; not, as is commonly stated, Brian Hodges; thanks to Mo Foster for this), and also, according to group members, John Rostill (playing on two tracks, according to Brian Bennett in conversation with Stuart Duffy; nobody could remember the two in question), though some have disputed this claim.

...don't you find it's really a bad album!!!?

It's not bad, it's just different. I rate it higher than a lot of the early albums, but that's because I'm not a big fan of early Shadows tracks. The first 12 bars of Proud Mary are a cracking album opener, and Paperback Writer is a really interesting arrangement. Give me those over The Bandit any day. With the right promotion (and if the band had existed as a coherent, touring unit to promote it) then it could have been more successful (but then we may never have had Marvin, Welch and Farrar).

Take the kazoo out and then it's a great album.

ribiers wrote:...don't you find it's really a bad album!!!?

No. It's a very good album. Received wisdom has it that it's not very good, and indeed bad. It's neither. It's a change of direction and sound for the Shads, which they obviously felt they needed by the start of the 1970s. Personally, I'd have liked to have heard some group originals, but in terms of playing and sound, it really can't be faulted.

Did we ever ascertain if John Rostill played on this album and if so, what tracks?