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abstamaria wrote:Here are the Ventures with "non-traditional" Ventures guitars, including a Hofner violin bass.

Andy

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bbpcrtzVMK8

I bet you those instruments (including the double bass drum kit) were hired or borrowed for that (mimed) performance.

There is some footage around of the Shadows appearing on Dutch TV (miming), with borrowed instruments, including a Gibson SG with Bigsby wielded by Hank.

JN

Jim, there was some discussion on this point elsewhere, probably in the Ventures forum. There are pictures of the Ventures in some other venues with the same guitars in that period (I believe the Trini Lopez show was in 1969). I recall someone who knew the Ventures said those were indeed their guitars.

I did a quick search.. From the Mosrite forum, someone wrote that the Les Paul Deluxe, Hofner bass, and SG Standard were the Ventures preferred live instruments, once they put down the Mosrites in '68. It’s uncertain whether Don or Bob recorded with the SG or Hofner, “but Gerry definitely used the mini humbucker equipped Les Paul Deluxe goldtop on most of the tracks he recorded with the Ventures (he was nice enough to answer this question, I always thought it was a Tele!).”

According to Del Halterman’s Book “Walk Don’t Run,” Bob and Don appeared for their Japan 1972 tour again “with the Gibson SG guitar and Hofner Bass.”

I read elsewhere that Bob Bogle liked his Hofner bass as it was very light (one reason Anna likes hers), until it was stolen. So it seems Bob owned the Hofner, but had it stolen from him.

Best,

Andy

Here is Bob Bogle with the Hofner "Beatles" bass and the rest of the Ventures with their non-typical guitars. this is from the 1969 Trini Lopez show.

Introduced in 1962 as Fender’s flagship guitar, the Jaguar I don’t think featured in any Shadows recording or show in the early years and probably never in the later years as well. With its chrome accents and plethora of switches, it reminded me of the early 60s American cars. It is quite a flashy guitar.

The Ventures I don’t believe ever used the short-scale Jaguar as well, preferring the Jazzmaster. However, the no. 1 Ventures-cover band here imported a Jaguar as soon as it was released, and one of my classmates got one too, so it was the one to have. It was the most expensive guitar in the catalog then, and there was no way I could even dream of getting one.

The guitar pictured is a new one, an American Vintage Reissue of the 1962 model. After 50 years, I finally was able to buy one. Note the "Fender Mute."

Andy

The Fender Jaguar cost US$380 in 1962 stateside. It cost more here in the islands after shipping and duties. To put that in perspective, a Mercedes Benz 190 in 1963 cost US$4,900 here, so a Fender Jaguar would have cost roughly 8-9% of a new, middle-level Mercedes Benz then. Now a custom-shop Jaguar would probably cost US$4,900, so the price relationship versus a middle-level Mercedes seems roughly the same as in 1962. However, off-the-shelf new Fenders are much cheaper relatively, so prices of guitars are lower now in comparison to the early 60s.

A close-up of the "Fender Mute," which Leo Fender believed would be handy.

Gretsch models (and knobs) have always confused me, but this is a 6120. Identical to the earlier “Chet Atkins” model, it was renamed “Nashville” after Chet’s endorsement contract expired. The new ones are named after Chet again. The guitar is identified with Duane Eddy, Eric Clapton, and Pete Townshend, among others.

Hank had a Gretsch, which he used for Nivram (and, according to Roberto Pistolesi’s camp, Apache and several other important pieces). Hank’s I believe was a Country Gentleman, a 6122 model, hence different from this one. The 6122 had double cut-aways and painted (not real) f holes, but there were variations, so it is all quite confusing. Perhaps someone will explain.

Anyway, as this is a 6120, it qualifies as a “non-Shadows” guitar. Hank in an interview though said his recollection was that Bruce used his orange 6120 to back him up in Nivram, so this may be a Shadows guitar after all.

The guitar pictured is a 1990s model, not mine, but left with me by a friend. I’ve had it for over a decade, but rarely touch it. I think I’ll use it for Nivram. I put flatwounds on it - would that be correct?

Andy

abstamaria wrote:Gretsch models (and knobs) have always confused me, but this is a 6120.

...from a particular period. The 6120 hasn't always looked like that. Often, you'd have sworn that it was a different model.

abstamaria wrote:Identical to the earlier “Chet Atkins” model, it was renamed “Nashville” after Chet’s endorsement contract expired.

Not quite. The Chet Atkins models (all with the name on the pickguard though not all necessarily produced at the same time) were:

(s) the Solid Body (similar to the Duo-Jet and Roundup but discontinued early)
(b) the Tennessean
(c) the Country Gentleman
(d) the Nashville
(e) the Super Chet (this one much later - 1970s, as pictured on the "Chester & Lester" LP).

See this magazine advert from 1969:



All three guitars (Country Gent [6122], Nashville [6120[ and Tennessean [6119]) are "Chet Atkins" models.

Chet continued to endorse Gretsch right up until the end of production in the USA. He never endorsed the Japanese production models, which consequently (in some cases) had to be given alternative model names:

"Country Gentleman" = "Country Classic"
"Tennessean" = "Tennessee Rose"

"Nashville" was OK - Chet didn't have the rights to that name.

abstamaria wrote:The new ones are named after Chet again. The guitar is identified with Duane Eddy, Eric Clapton, and Pete Townshend, among others.

True - though the resumption of the endorsement was a deal between Gretsch and Chet's estate, the man himself having passed away some years earlier.

abstamaria wrote:Hank had a Gretsch, which he used for Nivram (and, according to Roberto Pistolesi’s camp, Apache and several other important pieces). Hank’s I believe was a Country Gentleman, a 6122 model, hence different from this one. The 6122 had double cut-aways and painted (not real) f holes, but there were variations, so it is all quite confusing. Perhaps someone will explain.

The original models of the 6122 Country Gentleman (1958 - 1960) had a single cutaway. This is one almost (but not quite) just like Hank's:



Hank's was from a bit later and had a zero fret as well as a gold-plated "V-Cut" Gretsch-branded Bigsby.

abstamaria wrote:Anyway, as this is a 6120, it qualifies as a “non-Shadows” guitar.

No.

The one in the photo you posted (message above this one) is actually - more or less - identical to Bruce's 6120, as seen in "Summer Holiday" and used on UK TV at least once.

abstamaria wrote:Hank in an interview though said his recollection was that Bruce used his orange 6120 to back him up in Nivram, so this may be a Shadows guitar after all.

It is!

abstamaria wrote:The guitar pictured is a 1990s model, not mine, but left with me by a friend. I’ve had it for over a decade, but rarely touch it. I think I’ll use it for Nivram. I put flatwounds on it - would that be correct?
Andy

Probably!

Thank you, Jim. I knew you would sort things out. I remember your posts on Hank's country Gentleman (did that have painted-on "f" holes?).

That's very useful information you provided.

I played Nivram after I posted and compared the sound with the original recording. It may be Hank used roundwounds for the piece; with flatwounds, I can’t quite get his sound on the3rd, 4th, and 5th strings. I'll keep working on it.

Here’s a view of the 6120 that shows the raised pickguard and the thickness of the body.

Andy

Andy,

A quick word about the orange Nashville in your photo..

Gretsches fall into two distinct circuitry categories, according to whether they have a rotary tone control (like yours) or no rotary tone control (like my 6122 and like Hank's). The ones without rotary tone controls have two switches on the bass side of the upper bout, one of which is the pickup selector, with the other one being a pre-set tone switch.

All three Chet Atkins guitars in the 1969 advert are "two switch, no rotary tone control" models, but as yours bears witness, the Nashville and other Gretsches have been subject to constant design revision over the years.

I played my Gretsch on a gig last night. It doesn't often come out of its case but I thought I'd give it an outing. And a jamming player who turned up also brought a Gretsch (the candy apple red Setzer model with dice-shaped knobs). The effect was startling: it made me play in a rockabilly style all night.