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Quite right, Tony. After many years of wearing BBC headphones at work and playing on stage with a live band for fun, my hearing is shot to pieces and I am now a deaf old git.

In a pub, or a small club, (or a care home!), where the band is not being mic'd up through the PA, the minimum volume is dictated by the drums. If the drums are loud then everyone else has to be at least as loud to make themselves heard.

There are people who become drummers so they can bash drums very loudly. There are drummers who "can only play with sticks". There are drummers who don't understand the concept of 'balancing' their sound against the other members of the band. None of these people are suitable for a Shadows-style outfit.

Multi-rods, damper rings, gel patches - yes, and wire brushes. There are plenty of ways these days to bring down the volume of an acoustic drum kit.
http://www.footesmusic.com/accessories- ... es-rods-c6
and
http://www.footesmusic.com/accessories- ... atches-c16

In a band, it's not enough just to be able to play. you have to balance your sound against the others.

Tony Szpala wrote:...if you are subject to levels above 85 dB(A) for a prolonged period of time then you will loose part of your hearing acuity (well established by research). ..
Tony

All quite true, but rather beside the point I made, which is that backing tracks need to be carefully balanced with the live instrument so that (as near as possible), the recorded track is played out at the correct ratio of amplitude to that of the lead instrument as it would be if it were a live group playing.

The backing track is mis-named, in a sense. It is not there simply to be heard in the background. It is accompaniment.

Unfortunately, a lot of club employees do not have a clue how to use a noise meter correctly. We had an instance of a club steward telling us that we were way too loud, even though everything was turned down to a minimum. It transpired that he was standing within 15 feet of the stage with his back against a solid wall and another solid wall to one side, meaning that he was measuring lots of reflected sound as well as the direct sound from the stage. The solution? He got bored and went away!
Pat.

There is a lot of merit in understanding critical distance and what dB(A) or dB(C) etc actually means.

Sound engineers get a lot of value out of the DFA1 and DFA2 channels (you work it out But it is true that complainants will often go away happy if one or both are adjusted in response to their complaint.

The story of the Club Steward reminded me of the time we played a club in Driffield (a punishment I would recommend for all repeat offenders) We arrived at the appointed hour, set up and sound-checked with F/City. 3 bars in the power went off. Club Steward located, reset the trip switch and off again. 3 bars in....no power! this happened 4 times before the Steward pointed out to us the 'Limiter' installed the day before. I persuaded our singer to try an announcement... "Good Evening, Ladies and " No power! At this point, I started to pack my gear. "Where are you going?" "home!" "Why?" "Well, if we can't even announce ourselves over the mike, what's the point of staying?"
The Limiter was switched off immediately, and we had a good night. But I dread to think what damage might have been done to the Vox circuitry with all that On/Off business.
Re. Guitar Club volumes, it's always been way too loud at any venue I've been at. But, the audience volume has always managed to exceed it. Note to audiences...if you want to have a full-blown conversation with your neighbour while the player is putting his hard-earned hours of practice on the line DO IT OUTSIDE THE ROOM!!! A little courtesy MIGHT reduce the volume level.
Love to all,
Mart

And I thought it was only too loud when your ears started bleeding! That`s probably why i`m a bit deaf.

There is a school of thought, in certain circles, which says "If it's too loud, you're too old." I can see, or rather hear their point, but that still didn't stop me from wearing Hearos ear protectors during practices and gigs when I last played six years ago. Not an advert but a recommendation. I also take them along if I think a gig is going to be a little too loud. Nothing cool about being deaf. I can still hear a pin drop, which surprises me. I suspect that today's youngsters, who have to be plugged into their iPods (or whatever) at all times and play music (usually hip-hop crap) at ground shaking volumes in their cars, will be deaf far sooner than us!

martcaster wrote:The story of the Club Steward reminded me of the time we played a club in Driffield (a punishment I would recommend for all repeat offenders) We arrived at the appointed hour, set up and sound-checked with F/City. 3 bars in the power went off. Club Steward located, reset the trip switch and off again. 3 bars in....no power! this happened 4 times before the Steward pointed out to us the 'Limiter' installed the day before. I persuaded our singer to try an announcement... "Good Evening, Ladies and " No power! At this point, I started to pack my gear. "Where are you going?" "home!" "Why?" "Well, if we can't even announce ourselves over the mike, what's the point of staying?"
The Limiter was switched off immediately, and we had a good night. But I dread to think what damage might have been done to the Vox circuitry with all that On/Off business.
Re. Guitar Club volumes, it's always been way too loud at any venue I've been at. But, the audience volume has always managed to exceed it. Note to audiences...if you want to have a full-blown conversation with your neighbour while the player is putting his hard-earned hours of practice on the line DO IT OUTSIDE THE ROOM!!! A little courtesy MIGHT reduce the volume level.
Love to all,
Mart

Totally agree Mart, do we go to clubs for music or a natter, if it's the latter do it in the break!

take care

...Which reminds me...

I've got a few Shadows live bootlegs (as I'm sure we all have) recorded from within the audience in many cases. I've lost count of the number of times I've said "For God's sake - SHUT UP!" as I've had to listen to people nattering during Brian's drum solo! Unbelievable. But true!